I subscribe to Margaret Atwood’s view of EVERYTHING.
Though, I do think as I get older that her writing speaks of a certain generation of women’s struggles. Still
I 
Margaret Atwood.
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In general I agree, but until we have eradicated gender based oppression, personally I’ll be sticking to
Feminism. 
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Hence the “not 101”, I assumed. Remember when I said we can be our own worst enemies? Fractions and schisms because “you said X. I like Y. You like so-and-so, I like whatsherface, we can never get along” and judgement calls about “you aren’t X/Y enough”* enough are what keep us from getting anywhere. The status quo loves it when we squabble, especially over terms, even if we basically want the same things.
*except the kind of “white feminists” who pull the ‘fuck you, I’ve got mine’ bullshit on everyone else and TERFS. Their apathy and/or hostility towards even more vulnerable people is the opposite of helping.
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TERF is such a loaded word, I avoid using it all times because its meaning has been so broadened and diluted it seems to mean anyone who disagrees with a Transperson on any thing now.
And you have gleefully violent anti-terf rhetoric aimed at Lesbians that is seriously so worriesome, I honestly am wary around people that use the term now. 
Always good to remember that the powers that be are happiest when we’re fighting amongst ourselves.
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Talking about Not Feminism 101 - lets talk about the subtle sexism in this headline.
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His wife’s name is Kate Gorney. I don’t know what she does, but yeah, that headline is really something incredible. I saw a lot of that during the Olympics: “[So-and-so’s sister/wife/girlfriend/whatever] wins medal at the 2016 OIympics”. This somehow managed to top that by not mentioning the name of the person nor what she does, but then saying that she is somehow “making a name for herself”. This headline doesn’t allow her to do that figuratively or even literally.
I have no idea who T. J. Miller is. I Googled, and I still don’t know, and I especially don’t know why I should care.
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He’s one of the stars of Silicone Valley, and he was in Deadpool, he’s a funny and talented guy.
And apparently real good at picking wives!
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You mean Silicon Valley, right? Unless there’s a porn parody I’m unaware of.
I’ve heard of Silicon Valley, but never seen it.
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Dude, I am at work, I am not googling that…
But yes, that show, its pretty good. Its very much a sausage party… but then so is the tech industry, so its true.
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I was using it in the way that the acronym states: those who will deny a transperson a voice, because they refuse to see the “person” part. Can some transpeople be assholes? Sure… comes with being human. But I have seen a transwoman be told “you’re not a real woman” and not only can I not condone that kind of attitude, but as someone who has been bullied her entire life for not fitting the right mold, I have to condemn it.
And look at us. Back to arguing over terminology.
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As I said, they love it when we fight each other.
I’ve been called a terf (and other names)… because I’m pretty “gender-critical” and want to abolish gender roles in general, so, I am also sensitive.
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being 
trans is not about gender roles
… I never said it was?
Tbh your response feels a little aggressive when I have said nothing like that at all.
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I know what gender critical is, I wasn’t born yesterday. It is literally the name that modern transphobes go by.
You are putting a lot of words in my mouth, I ask you to please not do that, thanks.
And please try not to insult people here. Thanks.
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TERFS are real - I see cis-women excluding and attacking trans women in conversations and spaces, and questioning their gender. It’s wrong. It’s as wrong as white women telling women of color that they don’t know what it really means to be woman (which I have also witnessed). You exist, you are a woman, and you should be as free to be you as any white het cis-man is.
I also see some trans women telling cis-women how to (or not to) talk about our experiences of gender, sexual health, & childbearing. Denying that cis-women might have some wisdom about or experiences as women that trans women might like to hear. I see these trans women buying into the media’s ideas of womanhood and shutting down cis-women who question that narrative of gender. Like, by rejecting the gender binary, traditional gender roles, and talking about socialization that I am denying trans women. I am not. When I talk about my biology and my body parts, I am not shaming trans people who may or may not have the same parts. I am talking about my experiences as a woman - which are still considered controversial things to do. So when some trans people (of all genders) have come after me, it feels just like when men or older women told me not to talk about my period because it’s “gross” or “not polite.”
Fuck that. We all get to be free and open, or none of us are.
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You absolutely should be allowed to talk about those things!
Trans women have as varied gender expressions as cis women. There are a few high femme trans women who think that’s what being a woman is about, just like there are a few high femme cis women who think that. And the media centers both those trans & cis high femme expressions over others. The only way I see that you could call that a cis-vs-trans thing is that trans women are under even greater social pressure to present in a binary way in order to socially blend with cis women. Even then, some are able to present in butch & tomboyish ways, but the ones who prefer femme presentations or see it as a small price to pay to blend socially, should not be shamed for it.
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I agree with you COMPLETELY.
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Jumping in here…it looks like @MissyPants used gender critical in a different way that @enceladus is used to hearing it.
This is a new term to me. Maybe it comes with a buttload of garbage. But I also know @MissyPants online a long time and using it as an accusatory dog whistle is not the kind of conversations I’ve seen her have before online.
Can I get you each to discuss what you meant by the term? Also can we limit the use of “you” and see what happens if we talk about our own feelings and emotions instead of reading into what we think someone meant by what they wrote?
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I’d be happy to explain. First a warning: I must reference some extremely hateful language below; this is not my language, it is the language of people calling themselves “gender critical feminists.”
The most famous, long-standing communitiy on the internet who call themselves “gender critical,” is probably the reddit “r/GenderCritical.” Here’s a snapshot from that “lovely” place
There’s a lot going on here. “MTT” is what these people call trans women. An old term for trans women was “MTF,” meaning “male to female.” By “MTT” they mean they refuse to see trans women as either male or female; they continue this pointlessly demeaning language by using “he” pronouns just because their M.O. is to be as insulting as possible. If someone tries using more sympathetic language there they get shot down – because sympathetic language, may, in fact, engender sympathy.
They are so confused in their gender theory that they call these trans lesbians married to each other, “straight men.” “Autogynephilia” here is their pet conspiracy theory that trans women are perverted men turned on by the idea of being women. Because they deny trans experience, these self-described “gender critical feminists” have developed a whole system to try to explain trans people’s motivations as anything but gender identity and physical dysphoria. So since they think trans lesbians are “really” straight men, they’re left with the absurd conclusion that trans x trans lesbian relationships are “really” just two straight men.
The poster in this snapshot is so freaked out about these trans girls passing because one of the main “gender critical” talking points on that forum is how they can always tell when someone is trans – which would be a prerequisite to building trans exclusive spaces as they seek to do – this reaches absurd levels such as when they called this murderer a trans woman without evidence; she is just a cis woman who appears very masculine due to health and presentation.
This post isn’t by a one-off individual, as the comments later on the thread show; they state here they believe all “mtts” want to “rape” lesbians.
These are typical words of the people who have claimed the “gender critical” words on reddit. Similar can be found on Tumblr or Twitter. This is phobic, conspiracy theory level stuff, like the words found in any other hate forum online. The words “gender critical” sound, at first, good: who wouldn’t want to criticize gender? But these words above, aren’t good words, and they don’t, in any meaningful sense, criticize gender.
This is why “gender critical” is so effective as a dog whistle; it sounds nice from the outside, without revealing the rotten, hateful underbelly of the kind of language actually used on “r/GenderCritical” and other “gender critical” communities.
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