Wanderthread

nimelennar · August 28, 2018, 4:30pm

I don’t think he’s calling out the wording; I think he’s calling out the idea that someone can’t (or shouldn’t) criticize both the centrists and the far-right.

nimelennar · August 28, 2018, 6:38pm

Depends on what you mean by “criticism,” I suppose.

If, by “criticism,” you mean intellectual debate designed to get the proponents of such ideas to change their minds through reasoned argument, then yes, obviously, you’re going to get better results arguing against centrists than against the far-right, because you at least share a value set with them.

If, by “criticism,” you mean speaking out, on the other hand — demonstrations and counter-demonstrations, organizing and petitioning your representatives, trying to point out that what Fox News is writing doesn’t just mean that the smoke alarm is broken but that the house is on fire — Fox News absolutely needs to be a target.

The fact that you aren’t going to be able to convince your ideological opponents that their viewpoint is harmful and amoral shouldn’t mean that you stop denouncing it as such.

But you’re right: that’s a lot of subtext to extract from “Hm.”

AndyHilmer · August 28, 2018, 7:16pm

The Foxxers have to be examined as well though. Like the liberal commentators they speak entirely from an elite construct, a construct which has very carefully limited connection to the world outside elite society.

Wanderfound · August 29, 2018, 1:59am

Chomsky, yes. The ACLU not so much, but that’s a separate issue [1].

I wasn’t posting that for Greenwald’s bit.

I was posting that one to highlight the point that MSNBC is a greater danger than FOX. FOX is crude and obvious propaganda; MSNBC et al are dangerously sophisticated.

The main resistance to the left is coming from the centre.

—

[1] The ACLU are largely clueless white liberals. In normal times, they’re usually harmless and occasionally helpful.

In the face of fascism, they are dangerously naive.

Wanderfound · August 29, 2018, 2:44am

Wanderfound · August 29, 2018, 2:59am

#TheAssistance.

nimelennar · August 29, 2018, 3:47am

Hey, on the plus side:

There’s a decent chance they won’t go back on their word, like the right usually does when cutting deals, and
If they do go back on their word, who cares?

Of course, the negative part is they compromised with the Republicans. Again. But at least they’re learning not to expect thirty pieces of silver in return for stabbing their constituents in the back!