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Did anyone else initially read this as â3d Shacking?â
Like, thinking that this had to do with 3D-printed housing?
Anyway, to go on-topic:
My view of the whole âIs this inherently wrongâ issue being argued over is this:
It is not theoretically impossible for a healthy relationship to be formed in this kind of situation. There are some incredibly smart people who have been through their emotionally defining events as kids, and there are good people out there who would construct a supporting relationship with someone under the age of majority.
However, itâs practically impossible, because I think that a âgoodâ person would admit that assessing that kind of intellectual and emotional maturity is incredibly difficult, and it is always better to err on the side of caution when you have the potential of inflicting that kind of trauma onto a not-yet-fully-developed mind, and scarring it permanently.
It brings to mind the scene from American Beauty, where Kevin Spaceyâs character lusts after Mena Suvariâs, thinking her sexually adventurous and emotionally mature, and then realizing at almost the last possible moment that sheâs an innocent, emotionally vulnerable teenager. Which is how he should have seen her from the start. Based on what she had shown to him of his personality, it seemed a sensible judgement that she was mature enough for such a relationship, but thatâs exactly the point. You canât judge that kind of thing based simply on the outward persona someone presents.
So no, age isnât a perfect indicator of readiness for an adult relationship. But itâs the most reliable one we have. And the few good relationships that we would be permitting by relaxing those laws are outweighed massively by the manipulative, harmful, permanently scarring relationships that would be the vast majority.
I do think that itâs too much the norm that kids are sheltered from the unpleasantness of adult life; I certainly feel that I was. However, I donât think that adult sexual relationships are one of the problematic things that they should be less sheltered from.
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I have to say that living in a country with an âage of consentâ of 14 (with some restrictions which may apply here) it is a bit strange to read that whatever happens to be the law in the UK and much of the US is the God-given line in the sand that all good people everywhere in the world respect.
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Most people Iâve met from places with lower ages of consent do still think itâs creepy for a 14 year old to date a 30 year old, though some are more forgiving of larger gaps when itâs people in their teens and 20âs.
Hell Iâve heard someone joke, âthe age of consent is 14 here so when I hear the phrase âbarely legalâ I think, ew grossâ
Same person slept with a girl at a convention and freaked out a bit when he later learned she was 16.
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Oh, sure it is creepy. But there is a bit of room between something being wrong and people being monsters for not being sufficiently sure that someone has to rot in prison for it.
In the end of the day you have to draw the line somewhere and that line is always going to be arbitrary to some degree.
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Sure itâs arbitrary but, hey I could sleep with this person elsewhere has to run out at some point.
If 14 is cool, why not 12, why not 10 etc.
I honestly still think of 18/19 as teens and feel like once youâre over 30 you should stick to adults.
And illegal doesnât have to mean rot in prison.
I actually think graduated conditional age restrictions are better but I donât want to get into a big thing on reforming the rights of minors.
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I am beginning to think that Popo is trying to get to be the first ban recipient on this blog.
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The way I understand it is this this: for evolutionary reasons we wonât go into, teenagers have very strong sex drives which they find hard to control due to all those hormones swashing around. At the same time, their brain development proceeds rapidly. Eventually they do turn into adults, who also may have a very strong sex drive but are expected to be more in control of it.
When pre-adult teenagers have sex we should take into account what they are going through and the nature of the relationship. Thereâs room to exercise a lot of tolerance if nobody is getting hurt. When adults have sex we should generally stay right out of it unless the relationship is abusive. But when adults have sex with teenagers the default position should be that the older person is exploiting the sexual confusion of the young one.
It isnât just about power dynamic but brains function and hormones.
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At that age range, 2 or 3 years can be a chasm.
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Canada has a Romeo and Juliet clause that applies to minors within two years of each other in age (ie, a 14 year old and a 16 year old)
Still creepy.
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The hilarious thing is that the people who are cool with 14 being an age of consent get all up in arms of Muhammadâs child wife. Yeah. Fuck that shit. Adults should never, ever be in positions of power over a goddamn child. What Iâm sayinâ is donât diddle the kiddies.
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Ronnie Hawkins was quoted as saying, âNone of us rock and rollers could understand all the fuss about Jerry Lee marrying a thirteen-year-old. All us Southern cats knew she was only 12."
Whenever anyone says stuff about jailbait or underage or barely-legal, I always think about this quote.
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Gross. Romeo & Juliet clauses can make sense (especially in 17/19 scenarios where one person is a legal adult but they both may be of similar maturity), but actual physiological adults have no business being romantically involved with children or teens.
You have to have a balance of power for both parties to give meaningful consent. Adults and teens/children do not have the same power.
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Agreed on both points.
You are just not going to convince me to feel like a rape enabler for being generally ok with living under laws different from what you are used to.
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I definitely donât feel that people in different areas with lower restrictions are rape enablers.
I do have a problem when people do the sex tourist thing to get around restrictions, which is what happened in the article.
That shows a level of determination to sleep with younger people that inevitably reveals a real problem.
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I think youâre a bit fixed on the âsheâs 15â part.
Itâs more like âsheâs 15 and heâs 7 years olderâ.
I know people who had sex at 14 and have no regrets. I trust their experience.
But none of them had sex at that age with anyone more than 2-3 years older than them â and thatâs very germane to this discussion.
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My summary purposefully was vague; the minor is also male.
Seeing Popoâs remarks on this thread reminds me of Milo saying that he saw nothign wrong with old lecherous men abusing young males.
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Meh. I was just looking at the last several exchanges, but I donât know if it changes anything.
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Still trying to figure out whether to support Le Pen or Macron. Which one is less creepy?